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When Will the Church Get It!

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5 Comments

Pastor Jeff

Hi Aundaray! Thanks for the opportunity to speak and more importantly to be heard. You are very right in your experience and opinion about some church leadership that are outspoken against, if I may use the term, opposing cultures. The difficulty with the christian church is that it has an enduring truth to share yet there are so many who profess to be members of that religious body that do not know how to lovingly and effectively share the treasure they possess. This unfortunately is the result of poor or incomplete teaching and mentoring which the Apostle Paul relayed to Timothy and throughout all the churches he started. I would like to speak about one thing you said. You said, "If we really were to follow the many things the bible called a sin, we would all be sinners." With great humility we all must admit to being sinners. We all fall short of the glory of God. In my comment above I stated that if we are to accept the bible at all we must accept it in it's fullness, the convenient and the things that offend us. There is one common pitfall that many are tripped up by and that is that the bible we must remember, is not the word of man but the infallable word of God. It just so happens we here it coming from the lips of fallable men and women and fail to seek out the Word for ourselves. If we did, then I believe we would not only be convicted by the living God but absolute truth would also be revealed. How would we, how must we respond to absolute truth? Today, our society shuns absolutes because we do not want to give up the pleasures of this world for something we don't want to understand. The old question I think is still a good one; If I am right, I have nothing to lose, but if you are wrong, you have everything to lose. The bible says that if we see another christian, one who professes the same faith, doing wrong that we have the right to confront them. But, if they are not a christian we are not to judge, for judgement is reserved for God and God alone. For even Jesus said that He did not come to condemn the world but to save it. The question is, are you a christian? If you are then the church has a biblical right to speak into your life. If not, then the church has erred in its personal attack. I hope that you do not find my views as an attack but one of compassion. One more thing, I believe that my sin or my neighbors sin is seen as all the same to God. If we say we do not sin then we are calling God a liar. We are all in the same boat. The only difference between you and me is the decision we make after the heart revelation of the truth of God's word. Blessings friend!

October 16, 2011

Pastor Jeff

Hi Just a thought to ponder! The bible descibes that seed you are speaking of as a gift, a gift on deposit...the Holy Spirit. It is only the Holy Spirit that convicts us not only of our sin but also for our need of Christ. The sciptures are very much needed because they continue in the new testament to remind us of our depraved state of sin and the need for redemption through blood on the cross. It is to us today as the law was for the old testament. You are correct, even those having never heard of Jesus or the bible have an awareness of sin, God and an eternal destination. Look up the passages! If we believe that the bible, all scripture, is God breathed and inspired then we MUST accept it all, the convenient and the not so convenient for we all, as you iterated, will stand before God to be accountable without excuse. The difficulty is getting past not only the stigma of certain sin but the hyposcrisy we share in our own sin. If the one who lies or cheats or steals or lusts were as transparent as the gay or substance abuser then the face of the church would look much different. God is purifying His church. His word has not changed....we have! Lets stop pointing out each others sins and start confessing our own. That is the beginning of a reformed, working, loving church.Lets start living His Word! keep walking, keep learning friend. Blessing!

October 12, 2011

msoftie

I wanted to add another thought... I do agree that the church needs to step up and be welcoming and helpful to those living with HIV. I know that the Saddleback Church in California (Rick Warren) has a growing HIV/AIDS outreach ministry, but I do not know of any other churches in America that are as warm towards the infected. I believe stigma is alive and well. Until the infected come forward and tell the churches to step it up - I imagine things will not change. If the needs of infected aren't expressed, then how will the churches know whom to help and how? My pastor knows of my infection, but he is sworn to secrecy, and not really because I have fear of disclosure for myself, but for my son and how it could impact his life in this community. Unfortunately - Silence = Death and Silence = Peace

June 17, 2011

msoftie

I think it is interesting that you say that "Scriptures are meant to elevate not denigrate" - which simply does not give credit to what scripture really is, it is the Word of God. Good or bad, it's his word. God planted a seed in all of us, which is our spirit. Our spirits convict us, and although it's words are strong, scripture does not need to to convict us. We do it all on our own. Even those who do not ever hear a bible verse, understand sin. I get the comment about hypocrytical preachers, which we all know exist. Think that preachers are men, born with the same natural or unnatural lusts and instincts as all of us. They will stand at the Judgement seat and have to account for their life, just like us. Who are we to condemn them for being imperfect, as Jesus said, "Let the man without sin cast the first stone" And a side note, in case you forgot all bible lessons of your youth, yes, we are ALL sinners. Peace to all.

June 15, 2011

Tilson Msowoya

The world is 'dynamic' because it's so very far from reaching perfection by God's definition; i.e. without sin. In fact the world is becoming worse in terms of that perfection. But God is perfect and that's why He is the same yesterday today and forever. My advice to readers here: Repent or perish!

June 15, 2011

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